5-28: That’s pragmatic.
Hm, judging by the comments on the last couple of pages people really don’t like this storyline?
I’m not sure what to tell y’all, I’m trying my best over here and I’m sorry if this scene has dragged on for too long.
This Is The Worst Idea You've Ever Had
but this is a good plan….
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Rather than the storyline, it’s the way you are introducing this character. They just appeared, we know literally nothing about them and you expect us to feel something for them. “wow poor thing his parents don’t approve” I’d actually care if we had met this character before but now I can’t even stand them.
I think the storyline is fine and interesting. You can still sympathize with a character, even if we just met them. Anyway, great page, I look forward to both of your comics each week!! :D
I actually like it quite a bit. We learn some about ian’s family, we get to see someone not in-the-know react to the fairy thing, I like ian and nicoles friendship in this chapter, and iris being more understanding about ian being a changeling possible because she’s trans is neat. It would be cooler if iris/irving as a character had been introduced earlier, but I still like it
I like it.
Fuck the haters. Your story is awesome and your characters are awesome.
How about “fuck people dismissing literally every critique as hate”?
(I’m going to use singular ‘they’, because I’m not sure what gender pronoun to use about Ian’s sibling – no offense to anyone)
TBH, I don’t like the fact that despite the guy being introduced only a few pages ago, half of their characterization is “they’re trans*, and their parents don’t get it”. We’re supposed to care about a character that wasn’t properly established. I’m trying to be understanding, as it’s probably based off of Kytri’s RL experiences, but it isn’t good writing.
Oh well, it’ll get better.
Oh, sorry, let me rephrase.
‘Disregard those who would disparage your work, my opinion is that it is excellent and the characters in it are also excellent, although that is merely my opinion and other people are, of course, free to opine as they choose.’
Is that better?
Ok, so I’m going to throw this out there: main fault up to date is “We dont know Iris YET, so it’s hard to sympathize”. So what? That’s just being a jerk. I don’t know her so I shouldn’t have to care.
That’s just the readers expectations and it’s conceited in its own way. They expect not only that a character can’t just be a trans, but that they have to be something else before being a trans. Like Kytri SHOULD have put something else before it, otherwise it’s bad writing. Never mind that there’s still plenty enough room for Iris to be characterized.
Right now? No, I don’t love Iris and want all her problems to disappear or whatever, but I am interested in her issues and what Ian and Nicole are doing about it. I trust the author to take their time and reveal the different aspects of her character when it’s relevant to the plot and not necessarily when we want to know. Yes, if her characterization stops here it’s going to be disappointing, but have some faith will you?
I don’t dislike the current plot twist but it certainly came as a surprise. What I expected was the kid to say something along the lines of “ok, so where is my real brother then” and that Ian and company would get involved in some sort of half baked rescue mission in order to regain Irving/Iris’es suddenly lost trust. Maybe that’s a little too formulaic, but the return of the “real” Ian would provide for loads of potential psychodrama depending on what happened to him in the fairy world. I mean, if you were held 25 years a slave in fairyland and the person who got to live your stolen life rescued you, how would you feel about it? OTOH maybe the real Ian really liked the life he had in fairyland. Who knows?
I really like the storyline right now and the pacing; it feels realistic. The fact that Iris came out on one of the very first pages after we met her was a little bit jarring to me, but that was only because, like other people are saying, we didn’t know her yet.
he shows up, and right after Ian saves him from the poser vampire girl and gets a sword through him he panics and starts going off about how Ian’s not really his brother only to beg him for help as soon as he’s calmed down without so much as an apology.
who cares if he’s trans or not, he’s a selfish little jerk that Ian and Nicole are too nice to notice is a jerk at all. i have a very hard time liking a character who’s introduced asking for protection from being treated the way they just treated the brother they’re asking.
ok, i don’t mean to be adding on to a bunch of comment-fighting that slowly derails from the original post itself, but i’ve also got a major problem with a few of you. “orin” especially.
first of all, maybe use iris’s correct pronouns? as in, quite calling her a “he”? if for no other reason than you’ll eliminate the issue of several groups of people immediately becoming unable to take you seriously because you can’t be assed to use the right pronouns. i don’t care that she’s “just a character”–any excuse of “she’s just this” or “she’s just that” pretty much only says you have some kind of standard for who is and isn’t deserving of their correct pronouns, and the fact she’s fictional doesn’t erase this–“she’s fictional” isn’t any more excuse to misgender her than anything else. if you can’t use this fictional character’s pronouns for whatever reason–she’s annoying, she’s a jerk, she’s underdeveloped–how am i to know you wouldn’t use mine if i annoyed you enough? believe it or not, the way you act about stuff in situations where you can’t hurt someone speaks a lot about you anyway. it raises questions like, “would this person use my correct pronouns when talking about me in a room i wasn’t in?” or again, “would they use incorrect pronouns if they deemed me obnoxious or ‘a jerk’?” no matter what way you look at it, it’s shitty.
tom-tomy brings up a good point: why do you HAVE to know something else about iris first? why can’t the fact she’s trans be the first step in getting to know her? seriously, what is the difference between this crucial, controversial aspect of her character and any other crucial, controversial aspect of any other character? i wonder, did you not like terai either? can’t he be kind of a jerk, and wasn’t he introduced with a stressful situation? is it safe to assume you thought he was a girl (much like how you very much seem to think iris is a boy, which just a reminder, she’s not), and if yes, were you just as frustrated to later realize he wasn’t? did you write a big complaint disguised as a criticism then too?
and if you did immediately like or care about terai in his introducing scenes, what makes his situation much different and “better written” from/than iris’s? because based on your comments, i’m rather concerned the reason is that you don’t give two shits about trans issues, and this has nothing to do with the writing (flawed or not–that’s quickly proving, to me, to not be what we’re talking about), but the fact that this trans character has been introduced to you, and you, not caring about these issues, are bored and want something “fun” to start happening again, because a few updates of these issues is just too burdensome for you.
forgetting (or perhaps not knowing and maybe even not caring to know) the fact that this is a legitimate issue that a LOT of people face, daily, and that the fear of a trans person’s parents’s reaction is so often justified in this day and age it’s actually sickening, is far more worrisome than one “questionable” character intro. there are parents who would berate, throw out, attack and/or MURDER a child that told them they were trans, and there are a literal SHITLOAD of them. what iris is afraid of is completely legitimate, and with the way the world is today, wholly justified.
the fact you can’t be assed to show even a little sympathy NOT for iris herself (because she annoys you, fine, whatever), but for the real fact that real children are literally hurt and killed for the very same thing iris fears and represents… says a LOT about you. it says that this has nothing to do with the writing, but rather the fact that you’re not only bored with the current scene and what this character represents, but you feel entitled enough to suggest something needs to be done about this story because it’s not tickling your interests 24/7 and it’s even making you uncomfortable because it’s “jarring” and “weird” and “you don’t want to have to think about it”.
and why do i even have to point out that when ian was stabbed, he did weird faerie things that TOTALLY would’ve freaked any normal person out? and that panicking, locking herself in the bathroom and “going off” about how ian’s not her brother are all completely logical reactions when the weird neon-green-blooded creature insists he’s your brother, especially since she didn’t know what was happening (she asks what a changeling is only a few pages ago)??? and that ian’s smart enough to realize this was a completely logical reaction and clearly isn’t very angry with her for panicking and going off (if at all–the only thing that strikes me as POSSIBLY “angry” (more like distressed or MAYBE exasperated) is when he yells “irving!” at the jammed door), not to mention she doesn’t REALLY owe him an apology (though it wouldn’t hurt, either, but she doesn’t OWE him one) because, again, all of her reactions to ian doing a weird faerie thing are totally rational and they both pretty much realize this??????? point to me where ian thinks he deserves an apology, or even where he suggests he ever thought iris was behaving irrationally or was angry with her. i’ll wait.
and going back through all the pages since her arriving at ian’s door, she’s… really not much of a jerk? like, actually, where did you even get that. she’s almost instantly thrust into a chaotic situation, and for the ONE panel nothing abnormal is happening AND you can see her face, she already looks frightened or distressed. not to mention showing up at night like that is pretty weird, soooooooooo i’m willing to bet she’s there for some reason, and it’s an upsetting one. considering she didn’t talk about much besides the ian-changeling fiasco and her fear of her parents’s reactions to her being trans, it kind of suggests to me she might even be trying to get away FROM her parents right now. that’s speculation at this point, but what i’m getting at is she doesn’t really DO anything that can’t be easily explained by the fact that a vampire just attacked her brother who proceeded to bleed neon blood and might not be her brother at all and, oh, maybe she’s also currently worried about how her loved ones are going to feel about her identity? so she’s stressed (really stressed, because again, parents literally kill their fucking children over this, remember? and it sounds to me like ian’s parents aren’t very great) and by extension she’s snapping at people. well, gee, that sounds pretty goddamn realistic to me, don’t you think? or do you not snap at people when your life is literally at risk right here right now (vampire) and also figuratively-but-possibly-literally at risk (identity)? or do you just not have to deal with any of that shit because you happen to have the right gender and body and sexuality and skin color, as well as religion and mental health and a million other things, so society accepts you exactly as you are? lucky you.
(and on the note of her parents, someone commented on another page that it was something like “inconsiderate” of nicole to suggest that iris’s parents don’t deserve her if they don’t accept her identity. which, have we even met ian and iris’s parents? why the fuck are you defending their parents when both ian and iris clearly make statements, in this very scene, that suggest their parents are fucking assholes? no, if they don’t accept her identity, they DON’T deserve her. people who can’t handle and respect the identity and existence of a human being don’t deserve that human being’s time or affection. this is like, so basic right now. you know who else doesn’t deserve people they can’t respect? literally fucking everyone, because you know what it is? rude, at best. ABUSIVE at worst. you are not entitled to your friends, your romantic partners, your children; ANYONE. the end.)
“i have a very hard time liking a character who’s introduced asking for protection from being treated the way they just treated the brother they’re asking.”
i have a very hard time comprehending how understandably being afraid of a creature you have no idea what is (again, literally asks what a changeling is) and then, after merely CONTRIBUTING TO THE CONVERSATION (ian: “it’s not something they’ll understand; they’ll think i need an exorcism,” followed by iris’s, “i’ve been worried about that too,” is how the topic of trans issues and her coming out to nicole and ian starts, with ian prompting her to continue with “why would they think that [iris needs an exorcism]?”; she only asks if she can stay after nicole expresses obvious sympathy and concern for her, making it a pretty safe bet they’d say yes), is so hard for you and strikes you as annoying, selfish and acting like a jerk.
except i don’t, because i really don’t think this is about the writing. i think you just don’t like this character, you don’t like her problems for all the wrong reasons and you want to see the narrative move on. which is, you know, whatever–i can’t convince you to give a shit about a serious issue. but i am going to raise my eyebrow at the fact that you and commenters as rude as you feel entitled enough to this story to throw such a stupid fit and then cover it up as “criticism”.
and if i open up your cover story, and take a look at it as if it’s the legitimate issue and as if i can help you reach a happy understanding of the past several updates (which i don’t think i can because i think this is actually an issue of you don’t fucking care and you wouldn’t even if it’d been someone you’ve known and liked since chapter one coming out as trans right now (“why didn’t we learn this soooooooner!” you’d probably say, because you were “tricked”, right?), then i might consider, for a second, that said cover holds weight. perhaps introducing a character in a chaotic situation having a reasonable reaction to said chaos is “bad writing”.
then i think of aaaaaaaall the characters in all the world who are introduced in the middle of chaotic situations and having reasonable reactions to said chaos, and how totally accepted all those scenarios and characters are, and how well all those scenarios are written, and how if you actually looked at your own cover for maybe thirty seconds at maximum, you’d be able to name a few characters who entered their stories under the exact same circumstances iris did,
MINUS their problem being the rejection and danger they could face from being trans,
and how you probably like them all just fine and your excuse for not giving a shit about what iris represents is utterly broken. and you DON’T give a shit about trans issues–not really, not enough–because if you did, you probably wouldn’t actually have a problem with this scene. not enough to write multiple posts complaining about one fucking subplot out of the 5 chapters of various subplots you’ve surely read already.
and yes, it IS morbidly suspicious that it’s the subplot about the scared little girl struggling with her identity and the acceptance of her family that bores and annoys you to the point that you can’t just take a break from the comic and come back in a few weeks when there’s surely content you give a damn about again.
it’s suspicious because even if you don’t care about iris–and fuck, you don’t have to, hate her for all i care–you don’t care about what iris is dealing with either. you don’t care about an issue that gets people, especially children, especially trans women like iris, MURDERED. you care so little that you’d rather whine about the story “wasting time” on addressing that issue, that fear children like iris have. which tells me that it doesn’t affect you (as in, you aren’t trans), and it tells me you don’t care, or you selectively care, which just in case you didn’t know, might as well be the same fucking thing because either way you cannot be assed to care about the fears, struggles and dangers a living breathing human being faces, all the time, for fucking EXISTING.
and if, by some unlikely chance, you really are just upset enough with the writing to completely misinterpret a character’s behavior as annoying/selfish (when it’s actually totally rational and makes perfect sense) AND consistently and intentionally misgender her (because you obviously know she’s trans and i doubt you didn’t see the part where she literally said she’s a girl), then your writing skills also need a ton of work, because you expressed your problem with the story EXCEPTIONALLY poorly. but that’s not really what you’re upset about, is it?
i’m sorry the issues iris faces and represents are usually swept under a rug so far away from you, you feel the need to complain on the occasion you’re forced to look those issues in the eyes. is it jarring that you learn about her struggle being trans as one of the first bits of information about her? yes, it is. but you know what’s funny? that isn’t a sign of bad writing. that’s a sign of a society that fights, TIRELESSLY, to erase existences and struggles like hers. it’s jarring and “out of nowhere” to you because no one fucking talks about it.
but kytri did, and thank god for it. so kytri, if you see the end of this message: thank you. whether or not the writing was perfect is irrelevant (and it’s fine, really); you’re doing something that’s hard to do, and comments like some of the ones on this page are just one of the many reasons it IS hard. because the existence of someone like iris, like you and me, is “jarring” and “annoying”, so thank you for making people look at her and see her, and forcing them to acknowledge that she exists, and that people like her exist. please don’t let the bad comments discourage you from doing so again. the only way iris and people like her are going to stop being “bad writing” is if we keep talking about them. about us.
what you’re doing here is fucking brave, and i applaud you, and i’m proud of you and i’m thankful for you. happy holidays, kytri, i really hope despite this, it’s a great one.